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请新来的游客兄进来看下,也请这里论坛的朋友们来帮忙下

我看過一篇猶太人的文章,他們對「應許之地」並非如此堅持。猶太人的神學帶有一點點神秘主義,「應許之地」不必是地球上的某一地域,離開本族進入「應許之地」乃是一個回歸上帝的過程。

回復 41# 龍井樹 的帖子

It really depends on which Jews we are talking to.

From interview conducted by news agency, there are Jews that really wish to establish the "Greater Israel state" (With ALL Palestine) These are people that live near the border of the current Israel.  The 'Settler'.  

At the same time, there are fellow in Tel Aviv that feel perfectly fine living togather with Arab.
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It is the same everywhere in the world.

The scholar that writes a book tends to be the 'sane' people.  But most people are not scholar (including me), nor write a book.

Look at a liberal Christian and a Fundie, there is a real difference.

[ 本帖最後由 dye 於 2008-4-15 11:30 編輯 ]
原帖由 dye 於 2008-4-15 09:44 發表


Be fair.  

ACCORDING TO BIBLE,
The Jews also massacre many different tribes around the area until they establish their little kingdom.  You only need to look at what Joshua did

Even the once friendly Egypt that 'adopted' them get 10 plagues...

------------------------------------------------
Budhism/Hinduist:  
Karma.  Thousand years of bad karma is at work.

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Chinese: People who shave others head, will get their head shaved by others.
English: What goes around comes around

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Then again, we all know the story in the bible is bullshit


Let's face it, the Jews don't deserve punishment for spreading a fairy tale about them killing impossible number of people
(I mean, come on, 100,000 people in Palastine for hunting enjoyment? That's higher than most of the freaking Greek city states ADDED UP in that time period!
It's at best a nomadic raid on the local small villages that bearly has a wall.)
原帖由 dye 於 2008-4-15 11:27 發表
It really depends on which Jews we are talking to.

From interview conducted by news agency, there are Jews that really wish to establish the "Greater Israel state" (With ALL Palestine) These are peop ...



I'd say proportion of that is significantly lower among Jews, which is mainly due to their readiness to have their kids well educated in math and science.

You'll be suprised how Chinese and Caucasians are so readily influenced by simple persuation techniques of any preacher and starts to hate the scientific community to their guts - leave alone letting their kids to be educated accordingly.
Ok just let me play around with English again since Dye is using it...

原帖由 龍井樹 於 2008-4-15 09:57 發表
中東戰爭、以色列立國,猶太人只是歐美列強的棋子,維持歐美列強在中東等地控制石油生產運送的利益。正如美蘇冷戰時期一樣,中國是美國制衡蘇俄的一隻棋子,中國的經濟開放改革就是在這的背景下令中國走向大國之路。歐美基督 ...


NOPE. Jewish people won't really need their own state and they don't really have the numbers to sustain one. I mean, sorry, but that's pretty much like any "minorities" in China and any European countries. In fact, they lives must have been better in Massachusetts where the liberals will die to protect their rights than in Isreal where every neighbouring people will die to kill them.

If the Europeans truly want to atone their crime against Jews, they should have burned all their anti-Jewish Catholicism and Protestantism (ironically the later gets a better share) down to ground, and prosecute the surviving priests for faning their thousand year onslaught of halocaust.

And NO, that the Jewish people is a race is a mostly a myth. Jewish and Hebrew people had been and still are marrying people across the globe and mixes blood. In fact, Hilter  (that's one of the very few reasons why they still survived today admist utter hatred)



And dye's turn.

原帖由 dye 於 2008-4-15 10:31 發表
If you insist..  here is a bit of the problem

Let assume for a moment that US of A let one of their states gain independence and become a Jewish state:

Problem a) Which state?  Alaska?  Hawaii?

Problem b) Even though the state is Jewish, there are people living on the state already.  If the state is chosen on the bible belt, these fellow also hate Jews.  Do they need to expell all the inhabitant first and create a hunamitarian disaster?  Or do they let the two fight to death on the newly independent country?  (Before the independence, the relationship between Jews and Arab is not that bad in Palestine.  They have tried initially to create a Palestianian state where the two can live in harmony.)

Problem c) How do they import the Jews procecuted across the globe to that particular state? A lot of them is in Europe, and Russia.  Do they cross the ocean to Hawaii?  Or cross the artic to Alaska?  Or someone get a transport carrier and bring everyone to Carolina?

Problem d) Can/will the Jews feel related to a Israel state in say, Alaska instead of their 'promised land'?
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a) China in fact considered giving them a piece of their land. Well, if we had, it would have been a disaster because of the later cultural revolution that screws up effectively everything in the vincinity of Chinese soil. If Cultural Revolution did not happened, though, that would have given us a hell of a political capitol.

b) remember, Alaska, is NOT, I repeat, is NOT, on the Bible Belt. Only that it will be very bad for the Jews to settle there (trade opportunity is slim).

c) Jews did travelled to Isreal from US!

d) The million dollar question is how many of them really cared as long as the land is safe and favorable for development. And now thanks to the US and European fundie rulers in cold war, we'll never know.

原帖由 dye 於 2008-4-15 10:31 發表

The current Israel state is not the best, but the reason behind it is not solely political.


If you were talking about "national security", "need a friend in middle east" ...  NO. Things like Treaty of Tripoli have gave the US a MUCH FRIENDIER middle east than Isreal.

But if you were talking about selling the cold war by selling fundamentalism to the public which in turn requires selling anti-Islamic hate, then yes.


原帖由 dye 於 2008-4-15 10:31 發表
The reality is that Jews in USA is not concentrated enough to make an autonomous region for Jews.  If the fellow in Bible belt can vote a state into Christian heaven, so can Jews vote a state into Jewish heaven.  The question is do they have the number?

In voting, money can only buy so many vote.  USA citizen is no dumber than Chinese or Canadian.  What price do you have for your conscience (compare to your income)?

How much (compare to your iincome) does it take to hire you to vote against China interest?


Considering how Bush goes up to stage TWICE by brainless evangelicals singing around bible belt, I've serious doubt about the average intelligence of a citizen of United States. By the way, I came here only because some less than 30% non-fundies were on the other hand, utterly smart.

And is there a price for the conscience of the church? As long as their power is not disrupted, the answer is YES, and in terms of honesty they have shown and still showing a history of the lack of principles.

回復 40# dye 的帖子

Service Pack #1

>Problem c) How do they import the Jews procecuted across the globe to that particular state? A lot of them is in Europe, and Russia.  Do they cross the ocean to Hawaii?  Or cross the artic to Alaska?  Or someone get a transport carrier and bring everyone to Carolina?

Remember, US virtually never prosecuted Jews (courtesy of the liberals and deists), that's why they numbered the most in America.

回復 43# Nomad 的帖子

Com'on, but they successful in making people believe the bullsh-t!

Isn't it bad karma to spread faulty information? (And eventually created Islam and Christianity?)

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Yes they are more educated.  But people who acquire critical thinking seems to be minority for most part of history.

回復 46# Nomad 的帖子

Really?  What about the fellows on the Bible belt?

I assume you mean they never get procecuted officially.
"a) China in fact considered giving them a piece of their land. Well, if we had, it would have been a disaster because of the later cultural revolution that screws up effectively everything in the vincinity of Chinese soil. If Cultural Revolution did not happened, though, that would have given us a hell of a political capitol."

If we do give them a piece, nationalist will be burning Jewish goods everyday just like how they handle the Fishing Island.

"b) remember, Alaska, is NOT, I repeat, is NOT, on the Bible Belt. Only that it will be very bad for the Jews to settle there (trade opportunity is slim)."

Seriously, how many states in US is not populated by Christians of different shade?

"c) Jews did travelled to Isreal from US!"

Rich Jews.  Not every Jews is rich enough for the ticket.  Especially while they are being procecuted.  Consider that they need to bring their belongings over the ocean, it is no easy task.
Total Population in Alaska: 626,932 (That's TODAY)

Total Jewish population in US (US alone): 5,300,000 to 6,155,000

Total Jewish Population in Isreal: 5,393,400


Does that comparision helps?
原帖由 dye 於 2008-4-15 14:32 發表
Really?  What about the fellows on the Bible belt?

I assume you mean they never get procecuted officially.


I mean, dude. It's called federal law.
原帖由 Nomad 於 2008-4-15 06:19 發表


原本我都有一段這樣的時期
但是,看看歷史,其實又不能怪他們。
在已知的歷史上,猶太人是被遠東人(中、日、韓等)、美州土著和太平州土著以外幾乎所有民族迫害過的。
羅馬人憎恨他們作反,然後基督教崛起時,十字軍還沒打回教 ...


Highly recommend a book " The Battle for God -- A  History of Fundamentalism", by Karen Armstrong

This book provides a comprehensive background knowledge on theJudeo-Christian-Islam religions and historical events leading to theirfundamentalism.

回復 50# Nomad 的帖子

What is the population of US?  What % of it is Jews?

What % of Israel is Jews?
原帖由 catya 於 2008-4-17 08:34 發表


Highly recommend a book " The Battle for God -- A  History of Fundamentalism", by Karen Armstrong

This book provides a comprehensive background knowledge on theJudeo-Christian-Islam religions and
historical events leading to theirfundamentalism.


ThANKs to My Fair Lady Catya ,;--^),

i will////WILL check it out right away any way

i have always been looking for such a book , any more please dont hesitate to let me know ,
ThANKs again , cheers , pendragon  敬上

[ 本帖最後由 prussianz 於 2008-4-17 16:53 編輯 ]
exChristian.info前基督徒,主力:淚儿/泪儿,WEIYAN,龙井树。。。。。。。。。。。。。。。。。。。。。。。。警告 基督徒:你们一定不够他们玩
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