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(本來打算在[宗教是精神鴉片]內回覆的,不過思前想後,覺得這個回覆應該公諸同好,所以另闢新帖刊出,請諒。)
馬克思可說是伴著工業革命成長的一代。他眼見工業革命帶來的新興資產階級剝削勞工階層,可是那些工人一到星期日就上教堂望彌撒,讀經聽道,第二天就像沒事一樣上班;他認為長此下去勞工階層只會淪為奴隸,如果要進行革命,工人就不能上教會,不可再受宗教荼毒,這樣才有意志向資產階級反抗。所以,當時不論天主教和基督教,都對馬克思主義非常反感,這亦是二次大戰中,邱吉爾力抗共產主義的動力。

所以,在反耶教,呼籲人民脫離耶教束縛上,馬克思比我們早了一百五十多年。

             喔?百幾年咁耐?
Alessa is a daughter of Dahlia Gillespie. Alessa gets toasted in a ritual. Alessa is in agony. Alessa sends a part of her soul (the pure part, the part that wouldn't have to suffer) away in a form of a baby abandoned on the road. Harry finds the baby with his wife. They name her Cheryl.

The rest of it... You know.

總回覆

對的,馬克思做夢也沒想過,因為金融經濟起飛,造就了一批介乎於資產階級和勞工階層之間的,俗稱[打工皇帝]的新興中產階級;只是,對於維護、爭取工人權益,議會民主中的工黨成立,社會褔利主義的反思,馬克思在在都有極多貢獻,絕不可抹殺。
馬克思提出的,其實是要工人站起來,為自己爭取應有的權益,打破權力階級被資本家壟斷的局面,擺脫成為資本家奴隸的命運;大前提是要人擺脫宗教束縛,不要被[學生不能勝過老師,正如奴僕不能勝過主人]的思想洗腦,所以,他一開始就是反宗教強權。只是,當這思想傳播到一些以主奴文化、宮廷文化為本,只講鬥爭不講妥協,馴服強權而失去理性的國家時,就演變成階級仇恨,鬥地主、打土豪分田地,連串的血腥屠殺。
這是該國家的問題,不關馬克思的事。
因為我喜歡歷史,喜歡研究政治,所以我覺得沒有歷史、政治人物是過時的。
在歷史洪流裡,我相信[必然論]:馬克思這個人,是一定會在那個時候、那種時勢出現的,只不過,那個人的名字剛好叫做Karl Marx,如此而已。
Alessa is a daughter of Dahlia Gillespie. Alessa gets toasted in a ritual. Alessa is in agony. Alessa sends a part of her soul (the pure part, the part that wouldn't have to suffer) away in a form of a baby abandoned on the road. Harry finds the baby with his wife. They name her Cheryl.

The rest of it... You know.

對[得得b]的回應

你將幾個概念混淆了。
沒錯呀!文革當然是毛潤之的事;有人利用之作公報私仇,當然不關老毛的事。有人拿著棒子去打人,當然是關打別人的那個人事;他放下棒子後,別的人走去拿他的棒子打別人,就不關那棒子的主人事。這是簡單邏輯。
第二,褔利是不會自然出現的;人家煮好了的早餐,不一定因為你窮就會給你吃,這也是簡單邏輯。
記著,馬克思提出的是近乎建立一個烏托邦的理論,當然不可行;但他提醒了,工人也是人,也有能力作反抗的,這是事實。這也是簡單的邏輯。
當然,讀歷史要讀得通透,不是易事。
Alessa is a daughter of Dahlia Gillespie. Alessa gets toasted in a ritual. Alessa is in agony. Alessa sends a part of her soul (the pure part, the part that wouldn't have to suffer) away in a form of a baby abandoned on the road. Harry finds the baby with his wife. They name her Cheryl.

The rest of it... You know.

回覆得得b

讀歷史,不能死讀,要講理性,要用邏輯思考,懂得分析。
誰說一定要用鎗?建立工黨,靠選民投票支持,不可以嗎?
這個,也是邏輯。
Alessa is a daughter of Dahlia Gillespie. Alessa gets toasted in a ritual. Alessa is in agony. Alessa sends a part of her soul (the pure part, the part that wouldn't have to suffer) away in a form of a baby abandoned on the road. Harry finds the baby with his wife. They name her Cheryl.

The rest of it... You know.

又又回覆........

我這個人很不好,看事情總比別人看得複雜;看一段歷史,我不單尋找各個不同版本作對照,更會連同該時刻或該國的宗教、文化、民族的理念一併推敲,及當時該國的地位,與各國之間的關係,諸如此類。
歷史最惱人的,就是很多事都不如想像般簡單;單看一兩本著作就對某些人物、政治事件之類評頭品足,就很容易局限了思維。
這就是我所謂[讀通歷史]的意思。
Alessa is a daughter of Dahlia Gillespie. Alessa gets toasted in a ritual. Alessa is in agony. Alessa sends a part of her soul (the pure part, the part that wouldn't have to suffer) away in a form of a baby abandoned on the road. Harry finds the baby with his wife. They name her Cheryl.

The rest of it... You know.

回覆得得b

這種政治辯論,若是日常生活的話我可是隨時奉陪 ;不過,這裡是讓離教者安心立命之所(不可說成是[安身立命吧]? ),所以,還是將話題放到基督宗教裡去吧。
我提到馬克思,不過只想強調,他在反耶教立場比我們早了很多很多而已。
Alessa is a daughter of Dahlia Gillespie. Alessa gets toasted in a ritual. Alessa is in agony. Alessa sends a part of her soul (the pure part, the part that wouldn't have to suffer) away in a form of a baby abandoned on the road. Harry finds the baby with his wife. They name her Cheryl.

The rest of it... You know.

回復 #23 Step.King 的帖子

可是,現在則輪到基督教教會被赤化了。
Alessa is a daughter of Dahlia Gillespie. Alessa gets toasted in a ritual. Alessa is in agony. Alessa sends a part of her soul (the pure part, the part that wouldn't have to suffer) away in a form of a baby abandoned on the road. Harry finds the baby with his wife. They name her Cheryl.

The rest of it... You know.
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