沙文

A: If god knows the death will be resurrected, the meaning of jesus' death is at most just performing a show for us to see!

A: If god knew Jesus will be resurrected, the meaning of his death is at most just a show for us to see! <=== take away "performing" for very short

注：點樣"for us to see"呀?您有睼過這個show咩?仲有冇飛賣?
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A: That how can you know that god really loves you?
Then how can you know God really loves you?

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咁又得唔得？Circus act 係咪更接近「馬騮戲」？

If god knows the death will be resurrected, the meaning of jesus' death is at most just performing a circus act!

沙文

回覆 42# 抽刀斷水

唔得。
God係早知道，唔係依家先知道，所以要"knew".
係Jesus resurrected唔係death resurrected.
至於performing, 您係都要講都唔係錯，只係too much fish 啫。

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If god knew jesus would be resurrected, the meaning of jesus' death is at most just a circus act!

OK?

沙文

回覆 44# 抽刀斷水

都係用番show啦。circus act太過冇劇情, 傾向於技藝表演類, show 就類近drama多些，較為貼切

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如何突出是「馬騮戲」而非普通show?

沙文

回覆 46# 抽刀斷水


    farce

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加入beforehand突顯「明知」：

Q: God gave the only begotten son's life to wash us from our sins in his own blood.
A: If god knew beforehand that jesus would be resurrected, the meaning of jesus' death is at most just a farce!

dye

回覆 28# 抽刀斷水

回覆 28# 抽刀斷水

I would suggest to use the bible to defeat itself.

In the bible, it said a good tree would bear good fruit (Mathew 7:15-20)

If we find bad fruit on the tree, we do not to try every fruit on the tree to conclude it is a bad tree, or do we?  Mathew would suggest not to pick grapes from thornbushes.

Of-course in real life, an incomplete theory is still useful; the same tree can bear both good and bad fruit, then again, Mathew is not exactly a gardener, is he?

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Below is the full verses in context (NIV) for quick reference

15Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves.

16By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles?

17Likewise, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit.

18A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit.

19Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.

20Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them.

dye

回覆 32# 抽刀斷水

The core of your original argument is an economic one.  Look at it like an investor:

Step 1) The opportunity cost of reading the bible to the end, learning Hebrew and the related history.  It usually translate into spending the rest of your life.  People value their life differently.  Some people just have nothing better to do!

Step 2) The potential chance of being "saved".  Although past performance does not guarantee performance, it is a reference for future.  How else can be make a better estimate?  

If you find contradiction in the "past" reading, it is a reference for chances of contradiction in continue reading.  Of-course, if you read on and find more and more contradiction, you will have the more references.  The risk of getting the estimation wrong decreases.

Step 3) The benefit of being "saved".  Not everyone enjoy the heaven as described in the bible.  However, it is highly subjective as some people would care less about their friends and relatives in hell.

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If the result of step
1 < 2 X 3, continue reading (Notice the multiplication)
Otherwise, please stop.

dye

回覆 50# dye

In your original argument,

The cost is the potential to suffering from food poisoning.  Health is usually highly valued.

The benefit is the potential to eat a good egg.  Eating a good egg is unlikely very valuable.

The reference is the first bite that shows the egg is rot.  The probability of the egg being rot is low.  

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Conclusion, do not eat the egg.  

If the factors change, the conclusion can change.  For example, if the person is about to die any way and he really enjoy this only egg he has, it may worth a try to swallow the whole egg.  

Otherwise, if it can be demonstrated that the rot part is not representative to the egg, for example, it can be seen visibly that the egg is only rot at a particular part, the conclusion can be different.  (For an egg, it is unlikely because fungus/bacteria/chemicals would spread inside the egg rather rapidly.)

dye

回覆 32# 抽刀斷水

As a person spend a greater portion of their life on the bible, it would become harder for them to give up psychologically.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Escalation_of_commitment

Even though rationally, they know they should give up as greater evidence is gather (as I explained above).

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Interestingly, the stress experienced by ex-christian can be understood this way.

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謝謝演譯此題背後的精髓。

以經文來反駁叫人不要再看此經書，看似矛盾，但不失為有力方法。

"You won't eat all the bad fruits beared from a tree to recognize the tree is bad."

沙文點睇？

（據我的感覺，許多教徒都沒有閱完整本經書，他們這樣說只是想「大」非教徒而已。）

沙文

回覆 53# 抽刀斷水


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Of-course in real life, an incomplete theory is still useful; the same tree can bear both good and bad fruit, then again, Mathew is not exactly a gardener, is he?
dye 發表於 2014/3/25 22:56

You're God damn right!上次去摘士多啤梨我都經已發現此問題，不過為了謹慎起見我打算去多一次reconfirm先發表。現今得您testify就最好了
http://www.whittamoresfarm.com/

Mathew 、耶穌之流成日充內行，此亦是【聖經錯謬補遺】。遲些要補上

沙文

Q: All evildoings of christians over the years are irrelevant to the god.
All evildoings of Christians over the years are irrelevant to God.

You may not like it but this is the way they talk about God.  They don't usually put a "the" before "God".
If they say "Lord" there would be a "the".

dye

The quick and effective gardening technique to have a tree that bear two very different kind of fruits - grafting.
http://blogs.scientificamerican. ... -fruit-salad-trees/

Other alternative to have same tree growing good and bad fruit includes, growing in different year and therefore weather.
http://wine.about.com/od/winebasic1/a/WhyVintageMatters.htm

Or growing on different soil.
http://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E5%8D%97%E6%A9%98%E5%8C%97%E6%9E%B3
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Don't waste money in experimenting something you already knew.  As an experienced wine taster, you already know a bottle of 96 Bordeaux is very different from 92 of the same vineyard, eh?
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Some Christians know in their heart there is natural variation of fruit on the same tree.  「樹大有枯枝」

http://chrisleung1954.mysinablog.com/index.php?op=ViewArticle&articleId=2094779

As I would say, they are just unwilling to admit it as undisciplined investors are unwilling to cut loss.

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回覆 55# 沙文


    唔要the沒有問題，但是God還是god，也要仔細考慮……使用god會否更為政治正確？

http://australianatheist.blogspo ... -lowercase-g-g.html

沙文

回覆 56# dye
唔知咁樣係衰樹結好果還是好樹結衰果?

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其實經文中所謂壞果子，係咪指有毒果尐？

一棵樹結既果子無可能又無毒又有毒，但就實有尐爛果子、有尐未爛呢。

dye

回覆 59# 抽刀斷水

回覆 59# 抽刀斷水

I briefly check a list of poisonous plants, please check out "Cassava"

Cassavas grown during drought are especially high in these toxins.[5][6] A dose of 40 mg of pure cassava cyanogenic glucoside is sufficient to kill a cow. It can also cause severe calcific pancreatitis in humans, leading to chronic pancreatitis.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_poisonous_plants
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Notice how soil condition matters.
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Another common one is potato.  It is toxic if it begins to sprout.  You can imagine some potatoes from the same plants sprouting before the others.

The opposite is true of tomato. A very raw tomato is slightly toxic.