旁觀者

原帖由 onlyaaaa 於 2008-9-3 00:46 發表
就如：爱父母只是因为耶叫我去爱，没有了我便不爱。
爱父母是基本的良知道德，并不应该有一个某某指导性文件或规范手册来指导你去爱
否则这个就不是爱，也不是什么真正的积极的东西

移鼠是叫你去殺父母而非愛父母：
        「人到我這裏來，若不恨自己的父母、妻子、兒女、弟兄、姐妹和自己的性命，就不能作我的門徒。」《路加》14：26
        「弟兄要把弟兄、父親要把兒子，送到死地。兒女要與父母為敵，害死他們。」《馬太》10：21

[ 本帖最後由 旁觀者 於 2008-9-3 11:11 編輯 ]

weakest

For me, I am Ex-christian because of the nasty God, but not the people. There are some nice Christians. If I simple judge by people, I may now still be a Christian.

劈柴

"true.. what i wanna say is that dont look at people.. see into God.. "
how the hell do i do that when:
1. the first claim that god exists comes from the bible...which is written by PEOPLE
2. the second claim that god exists comes from Christians...who are PEOPLE who become Chirsitans because they read the bible...again...wtitten by PEOPLE...
Christians are basically PEOPLE who represent god on Earth...if we cannot look at people who represent god...no way we can see into god...

HTBROKE1

原帖由 onlyaaaa 於 2008-9-3 00:46 發表
看来我英语有够烂。。。
有3段啦。。。
第一段和第二段
说如果一些坏的基督徒和消极的东西的话
那么全世界的基督徒和那些历史事件，只有坏的和消极的了
没有好的
还有就是，那些所谓的积极的事情，也是出于某些目的而去达 ...

看來英文爛的是我

或者......我們兩個還是快點溫習比較好

onlyaaaa

看来我英语有够烂。。。
有3段啦。。。
第一段和第二段
说如果一些坏的基督徒和消极的东西的话
那么全世界的基督徒和那些历史事件，只有坏的和消极的了
没有好的
还有就是，那些所谓的积极的事情，也是出于某些目的而去达到的
就如：爱父母只是因为耶叫我去爱，没有了我便不爱。
爱父母是基本的良知道德，并不应该有一个某某指导性文件或规范手册来指导你去爱
否则这个就不是爱，也不是什么真正的积极的东西

最后那段只是说，我为什么不是基督徒
因为我爱家里人超过了这个所谓的根本不存在的垃圾耶

HTBROKE1

原帖由 Guest from 123.2.245.x 於 2008-9-3 00:40 發表
true.. what i wanna say is that dont look at people.. see into God..
as for myself.. if i look at people.. gosh.. even in my church.. there's lots of selfish people..
if i only focus on them.. i'll  ...

有這樣的機會的,前提是我們兩個都要有心。

在各自的陣營努力吧

true.. what i wanna say is that dont look at people.. see into God..
as for myself.. if i look at people.. gosh.. even in my church.. there's lots of selfish people..
if i only focus on them.. i'll never become a Christian

anyway.. fairly late here.. chat to you again if got chance

HTBROKE1

原帖由 onlyaaaa 於 2008-9-3 00:36 發表
“why look at some bad Christians and some negative historical events as evidence? why not explore the bible yourself?”
you said  "some bad Christians and some negative historical events as evidence" ...

沒理解錯的話,你想說的,是「我有自由去愛誰」是不是??

onlyaaaa

“why look at some bad Christians and some negative historical events as evidence? why not explore the bible yourself?”
you said  "some bad Christians and some negative historical events as evidence"
sorry,not some but all .
if there are some and the number of Christians are "some"

Look at the positive things that Christian belief have in the world as well
sorry, they do things have purposes
and,if i don`t agree the  Christian
i `m a devil

other way
37愛父母過于愛我的，不配作我的門徒；愛兒女過于愛我的，不配作我的門徒；
i love my fanliy more than the motherfuck GOD
so, i can`t be the Christian.
ok, in your eyes  i`m a devil just caus i 愛父母過于愛耶的

sorry poor english

HTBROKE1

原帖由 Guest from 123.2.245.x 於 2008-9-3 00:23 發表
okay.. here we go again.. the verses u highlight in red.. they are saying we as Christians should put God before everything.. even our family.
36人的仇56敵就是自己家里的人。
37愛父母過于愛我的，不配作 ...

只看好的一面,而忽視壞的一面,是會做成大災難的。歷史上有一大堆例子。

我們在這裡討論著,就是要面對壞的一面。要面對的總要面對。

weakest

"human flesh is from dirt right? im sure you learn or read that from somewhere"

---------->I read it.

"or its almost common sense now"

--------->I can't represent most people in the world. So, how can I say this is a "common sense"?

weakest

"i was talking of an entirely different thing.. spiritual world?.. if you dont believe such thing exist.. then i'm have to stop my words here."

---------->1. I am not sure. BUT, believing in spiritual world DOESN'T MEAN we should believing in Christianity. Christianity gets the copyright of the term "God", "spirit"??

"Look at the positive things that Christian belief have in the world as well?.. charities?

why look at some bad Christians and some negative historical events as evidence? why not explore the bible yourself?"

---------> 1. Just look at the negative things is not fair, BUT, LOOKING AT THE POSITIVE THINGS only is NOT FAIR also. As I always said, there are many nice Christians. But, the fact that the Christian God is nasty won't be changed even if we JUST LOOK AT THE POSITIVE THINGS

the bible itself says its words from God.. and i'm a believer.. so yeh.. i did assume it..

and.. human flesh is from dirt right? im sure you learn or read that from somewhere.. or its almost common sense now.. everything you find from the body you can find from dirt..

okay.. here we go again.. the verses u highlight in red.. they are saying we as Christians should put God before everything.. even our family.
36人的仇56敵就是自己家里的人。
37愛父母過于愛我的，不配作我的門徒；愛兒女過于愛我的，不配作我的門徒；
why not copy verse 37 too?
or did you get these evidence from that truthbible.net or something?

i was talking of an entirely different thing.. spiritual world?.. if you dont believe such thing exist.. then i'm have to stop my words here.

Look at the positive things that Christian belief have in the world as well?.. charities?

why look at some bad Christians and some negative historical events as evidence? why not explore the bible yourself?

weakest

"Christian have no right to comment about god.. in fact no human could.. cos we are only dirt from ground after all.  but all we are doing is telling people hat God has told us.. which is from the bible.. nothing more. "

--------->1. This assumes that: Bible is what the God (if exists) says.

HTBROKE1

原帖由 Guest from 123.2.245.x 於 2008-9-2 23:54 發表
umm.... im not sure if i understood Chinese entirely..  you are right.. Christian have no right to comment about god.. in fact no human could.. cos we are only dirt from ground after all.  but all we are doing is telling people hat God has told us.. which is from the bible.. nothing more.

yes.. you are right again.. bible did say to fight.. in fact it says we are god's army.. and have to put on our whole set of armour. but we are not fighting human beings.. we are fighting against sin and devil. im sure u know the bible tells us to love our enemy. that is.. to love the person but dislike their deed.

太十：34-36，主耶穌說：

34你們不要想，我來是叫地上太平﹔我來并不是叫地上太平，乃是叫地上動刀兵。
35因為我來是叫'人與父親生疏，女兒與母親生疏，媳婦與婆婆生疏。
36人的仇敵就是自己家里的人。


如果這是你們想告訴世界的話,我無話可說

聽過一句說話:「你的善意,正為其他人推向地獄的道路」
這世界由不同的價值觀組成,不可能統一成為一種。

由事件本身引起的結果,看看歷史,基督教帶來的只有更多的流血和眼淚。因此不需要理解教義本身。

umm.... im not sure if i understood Chinese entirely..  you are right.. Christian have no right to comment about god.. in fact no human could.. cos we are only dirt from ground after all.  but all we are doing is telling people hat God has told us.. which is from the bible.. nothing more.

yes.. you are right again.. bible did say to fight.. in fact it says we are god's army.. and have to put on our whole set of armour. but we are not fighting human beings.. we are fighting against sin and devil. im sure u know the bible tells us to love our enemy. that is.. to love the person but dislike their deed.

HTBROKE1

原帖由 Guest from 123.2.245.x 於 2008-9-2 23:04 發表
Christians are not God.. how can you ask a human to do godly things.. and bible says not to harm your own body, so i think those people you guys speak of are doing the right thing.

如果根據這邏輯,我不認為基督教徒有資格去討論神的事情,包括聲稱它的道義性。

但聖經教你去傷害他人(例如發動戰爭)。

Christians are not God.. how can you ask a human to do godly things.. and bible says not to harm your own body, so i think those people you guys speak of are doing the right thing.

旁觀者

消滅了這些「信主」的畜牲(菲律賓是天主邪教國家)，也是神蹟：
1.  「風神肆虐菲律賓死逾200 渡輪翻沉逾700失蹤。」
http://news.epochtimes.com/b5/nf3761.htm
2.  「數百人喪生，在菲律賓風暴。由卡洛斯每小時conde 。發布日期： 2008年6月23日。馬尼拉：死亡人數從強大的颱風死亡... 」
www.iht.com/articles/2008/06/23/asia/23filip.php
3.  「超過300人喪生後，一場風波引發的洪水在菲律賓，官員說。」
news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/4054427.stm
4.  「死亡所帶來的越南的風暴相關的死亡人數增至27 。 三漁民溺斃的週一外海富日元省時，他們的船翻沉作為風暴接近。
        金融風暴，造成超過1000人在菲律賓，被包裝風73英里每小時的時候登陸，在越南南部省份的檳知和茶榮就星期二上午，氣象預報說。
        對週四，榴蓮的衝擊，菲律賓與165英里每小時風速和5小時的洪水即脫落噸的碎片從斜坡上的馬榮火山。 牆的泥漿和石塊摧毀了幾乎每一個常設的結構在其路徑。
         “這是像保齡球，說： ”吉諾巴坦副市長基因villareal 。
        官方公佈的數字顯示， 450人死亡， 507人受傷和599人失踪，但參議員理查德戈登，主管當地紅十字會說，他相信超過1000人死在了數以千計的房屋掩埋下的火山泥石流，泥漿和洪水。 」
http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=zh-TW&langpair=en|zh-TW&u=http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15959573/&prev=/translate_s%3Fhl%3Dzh-TW%26q%3D%25E9%25A2%25B6%25E9%25A2%25A8%25E8%258F%25B2%25E5%25BE%258B%25E8%25B3%2593%26tq%3DPhilippines%2Bstorm%26sl%3Dzh-TW%26tl%3Den