貓貓剛剛變了無神論者
This is a long long road.
I started out as a Fundamentalist, because the church I attended was a Fundamentalist church (Rev Daniel Ng, now the pastor of Kong Fook Tong, and the church was closely linked to Society of Truth and Light).
I first turned away from my rigid position as a Fundamentalist when I found that I could not defend cases when churches or para-Christian organizations or Christian groups hire staff based on their religion (hire Christians only) as well as those rigid marriage rules (marrying Christians only).
In both cases the arguments for the positions are weak, contrary to my values of equal/fair treatment to all.
As I got plunged to a war between Catholics and Fundamentalists in a number of forums (CCfellow, allenchow.com, iShare, etc), all the deadly flaws, toxic teachings of Fundamentalism were thrown to my face. I met the meanest humans beyond description---spitting poisons, deceitful, abuse of powers (when they manage the forum), twisting truths, slanderous, etc.
(My persistent fight with the Fundamentalists indirectly caused these three forums to close down for good. There were at least 2 others which met the same fate).
It is then I changed my position to a "mainstream Baptist" (after I was influenced by writings of this site www.mainstreambaptists.org). I questioned the validity of Bible inerrancy, literal interpretation, anti-Catholicism, once-saved-always-saved, sola fide, sola scriptura, etc.
In fighting with the Fundamentalists alongside with Catholics, I delved into books of all brands of Christianity---Catholicism, Lutheranism, Baptists (of course), Calvinism, Eastern Orthodoxy, touching subjects on salvation, end times, liberal theology, etc.
It was then I started to pick up logical thinking and reasoning again, because I must be able to weigh each brand of Christianity on their merits. I owned almost all books by 李天命. There are a number of Christian theologian-written books trying to debunk 李天命, but their arguments were laughable.
Then comes ID (Intelligent Design), the Noah's Ark fiasco of Media Evangelism. Both incidences drawn me to look at evidences of the origin of earth and evolution. At the point I remember saying to a Fundamentalist (a more benign one) that I don't think the Flood happened exactly the way it was written in the Bible (I believed it was a local flood, and later I found it to be true, only that Noah became a Babylonian). By this I effectively denied literally interpretation.
The next tipping point, as I remember, was SODO (2005).
I took on the HK brand of Christian Right-wing directly and sharply criticised their actions, wrote long articles and debated with right-winged Christians on Christian Times.
When Rev. Silas Wong was forced to resign, and along with the deceitfulness of KWAC, the silence of Christian community over this, and 梁家麟博士 defending it, I lost faith totally in the evangelical circles of Hong Kong. They were just like any ideological groups, refusing to listen to facts and different opinions. I was also convinced then homosexualilty is something similar to psychiatric diseases or of in-born nature, and that they were not morally wrong.
These events gradually changed me, I already thrown out Bible inerrancy, I thrown out "simple faith", I denied that homosexuality is a sin, it was only a matter of time before I thrown out the miracles, God creationism, etc.
I did not remember when, I purchased a book written by 方舟子(方舟子揭開世界之謎). In the book there is a full section refuting all psuedo-scientific claims cooked up by Christians to claim evolution is a "theory". How different schemes by Creationist can be debunked by rigorous science.
Round about the same time I purchased "The God Delusion" by Richard Dawkins, and in it loads of reasons that God is not necessary nor the hand in everything that happened.
In a separate incidence, I had a confrontation with my church's senior pastor over the question of "once-saved-always-saved".
During the conversation, he just printed out 10 pages and said there were "over 100 verses in the Bible" that proved "once-saved-always-saved". He was not ready to discuss with me, he wanted me to submit. I challenged him a number of points citing the Christian Times article then labelling a church "heretic":
Me: the article listed a number of criteria that makes this church heretic. One is the divinity of Christ, one is pastoral authority, and the other one is "rejecting once-saved-always-saved". I reject once-saved-always-saved, you said the other Sunday with emphasis on this point when talking about this church. Answer me, am I now a heretic?
Pastor: ..... you took the words out of context, it should be placed alongside with the others...
Me: this is illogical, if you listed it there, then as long as you fulfill the one or more of it, then it meets the criteria
Pastor: ....no ..no, you have to consider it with others
Me: then this criterial "rejecting once-saved-always-saved" should not be there ?
Pastor:.....I am a Baptist minister for 40 years, I was to preach the truth in the Bible, once-saved-always-saved is the truth as proven by the Bible.
Me: then what about the Methodists, the Lutherans, surely you know they don't teach once-saved-always-saved ?
Pastor: I don't comment other churches. I tell you, I am a veteran minister who preached for 40 years. We preach the truth said in the Bible. The Bible is literally true, the world is created in 6 days, each day a 24 hour day. Do you know that in USA the South Western Theological Seminary, once professor published a set of commentaries and used the word "myth" to describe Genesis ? He was sacked and the whole set of commentaries were rewritten. I preach what I believed is true and I do not have to answer individual. You are free to read anything you like, but in my church, it is what it will be taught.
.....
We have no common ground.
The above incidence convinced me that I could not stay in this church as long as this pastor is there.
To research on Creationism, I went to www.infidels.org to look for more research material. Most questions of evolution was answered by 方舟子, but there was yet a question not answered, how do the universe arise? (Creation Ex nihilo)
This site gives me that article: http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/mark_vuletic/vacuum.html
Then I also realized, the preposition that "things can only come to existence via creation, before that there is nothing" contains an assumption -- "before that there is nothing".This assertion is unfounded, why can't it be that things were there all the way along, then creation will be unnecessary.
The articles answered my doubt, and then I realized that Creation thing is now out of the window. The same night, I was supposed to attend the Hong Kong Franklin Graham Festival (I was one member of the big choir), then I found that I could not bring myself to go.
My mind would not allow it. I loved singing, but my mind told me that I could not do it, I should not go.
I kept this change of mind for about 2 months, I go to discussion forums as usual, but my demeanor has changed already.
During this period, I purchased a number of DVD from BBC discussing Bible mysteries (the Flood, the fall of Jericho, Jesus' death etc). Those materials confirmed me that God could not have existed, or the chances of it would be even slimmer than Jesus is a female.
I almost gave myself away when I told my ex-Pastor (Dr. Sun Po-Ling) that I was about to be an ex-Christian. He was kind, gracious and not a judgement word came out of him when I had coffee with him. He certainly appreciated me as being a socially concerned Christian, but he had no idea that I was so near to the brink of quitting Christianity.
However, the more I ponder on this, the more I felt I should make a decision. I decided that I should not kept this to myself so I declare it in discuss.com.hk.
I am planning my exit from my church friends and deciding how to break the news to my Christian friends.
I am lucky that most of my Christian friends are genuinely kind, friendly, and many of them are funny people that you will like to hang around with.
I hope that my news will not startle them. I have to really think hard on how to tell them.
I was initially worried that my change will also give ammunition to the hostile Fundamentalists (mainly on the Internet, e.g. in Christian Times), that they could use this against me and my causes. However, I reconed that I should not be deterred by those people, they considered me an apostate anyway.
However, I do not want my case to harm those groups I affiliated with. Those mean Fundamentalists can do anything just to show that they are righteous, so I have to plan my exit very carefully.
.....
抽覆：
貓姐：
看到你的文章，十分欣賞你的坦誠和勇氣。我想你在宗教問題的透切了解，絕對在許多人之上（包括我在內）。
對於在信仰問題上的痛苦掙扎，我想你已一一承受過。因此，儘管在立場上是對你的「新生」表示認同，但我不會「恭喜你」。我想，你亦不會因此而停止一切對生命的思索和追求。
你的分享很值得借鏡，絕對是許多人希望獲得的寶貴經驗。冒昧一問，離教者之家可以傳載你的分享麼？
抽刀斷水 謹上
http://www.armbell.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4888&mforum=liberalhk |
2008/3/1 11:11
| 
2010/6/9 20:02
| 
耶教 ,對世人唯一有相似之處 ,就是自相矛盾 ,都幾合人性架
2010/6/5 13:03
| 